Forum - View topicINTEREST: Southeast Asia, India Fans Disproportionately Affected by Pirate Site KissAnime Closure
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Dark Mac
Posts: 315 |
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I feel like the smartest thing to do in that situation would be to subscribe to one service at a time. Just subscribe for a month, watch all the shows that finished recently, then cancel your subscription, subscribe the next, and repeat. That would save a lot of money. |
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AtoMan
Posts: 161 |
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Netflix is not a good option either, with basically no Polish dubbing even for "original" series and the subs being poorly crosstranslated from already poor english ones (which are often disabled for some reason). They put zero effort, the results is lower quality than a shitty speedsub, and then wonder why noone watches anime on Netflix... |
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capt_bunny
Posts: 364 |
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This shouldn't be a real shocker. At that age, I'm surprised if you can even have the money to afford one streaming site. I'm grateful CR has me allowed to see anime with many titles but as a broke college student (like many), we are told to focus to just trying to pay back classes rather than pay for amazon and Netflix streaming.
A lot of people were and are to this day. I saw a dub voice actor telling those for anime they can't get to "wait until its on DVD". You know, titles that EVERYONE can totally get outside of Japan. :roll: Many were telling him that not many people can get it in their country or cannot afford it which he didn't budge how understandable it is. Illegal sites are wrong but at least be able to understand if someone desperately can't. Kid you not, many like him said to use VPN to get American titles too. |
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xxmsxx
Posts: 565 |
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They are affected a lot more severely because KA and KM's main demographics are English-speaking. I know anime fans in Ireland and South Africa, and legal stream/license is never really on the table because the catalogue they have is basically catered towards a non-anime fan, someone who has never seen any anime. Ireland usually does better than South Africa, but being so close to UK but doesn't always get the same catalogue is highly noticeable. Another example is Australia and New Zealand. English-speaking, but to call their catalogue disproportionate is to be nice. I don't even think their catalogue is that small to begin with. In addition, some anime fans who live in countries that does not have any access at all. Checked with a Hungary fan, had to illegally stream in English. Brazil and Turkey has lots of anime fans. Met a few Kazakh fans, all speak Russian and English. Or a fan from Myanmar. Or even Algeria, where the primary operational language is Arabic and French. These communities are not new at all and growing by the day. They all found their way onto an English illegal stream site because this is literally the only way to watch any semblance of anime.
Let's take the Spanish-speaking community for example. Case Closed / Detective Conan has long been advocated among Central and South American fans to be added into CR in FULL (keyword) due to its much more concentrated popularity in that region of the world. However, this series is notoriously expensive so CR has made no visible moves to get this series at all, even just in Spanish. This series is not exactly a small niche show, yet it needs to be pirated by so many people. Yes, legal streaming brings in lots of money for the anime industry. However, it also cost an incredible amount of money to obtain and maintain a legal license. There is absolutely no incentive for any legal streaming service to think about any other regions outside of the US. The demand for anime is so high around the world, the legal availability is so low thus generating a major vacuum for pirates. I am happy to condemn KA and KM's predatory malpractices any time, but it should not stop people recognizing that for some people illegal stream was and will always be the only way to watch anime. |
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Dian Z
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I'm in SEA, and I find these results quite as expected. It's good that legal streaming services are appearing, we used to have extremely limited options to watch anime legally, but we have two free legal streaming channels on youtube, and maybe 3 or 4 legal streaming sites/apps. Although the titles offered are still pretty limited (that we can't even complain about translation quality, or streaming quality overall, since those are all we have), I see improvements. Even so, these sites/channels might still be relatively unknown to a lot of anime fans, so I guess it'll take time for us to move to legal services.
As for manga, I think it's always been problematic and not only in SEA. There's just never enough desirable variety of titles available legally. Unpopular genre like josei titles aren't likely to interest legal publishers here (in the case of my own country, gl/bl titles are simply out of consideration). |
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tygerchickchibi
Posts: 1453 |
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Not for nothing, I really hate to be on the voice actor's side on this, but my only guess is because we're too used to taking a lot of services for granted (in the US). While there is unfair comparisons (I've seen a link of one or two VAs that really went in), I feel the frustration is due to the fact that people here still obviously can afford to support the shows, but the obvious convenience is that it's "free." It only serves the uploaders who put the sites up and make millions of dollars for a market that is competitive. And of course, yay viruses! And people who are unsubscribing as a protest in favor of piracy aren't helping the areas that have no access, at all. And I have friends who would support legal streaming services overseas if they're availble (And affordable). I wish for once we can focus on accessibility and making it easier for them to support the shows that they love. However, I would never EVER want to be one specific streaming services for all anime titles. Look at Facebook--they're domininating social media. Look at Dish Network only being available in a certain region, and they suck. Having one controlling entitiy that streams all anime? That sounds really bad. I prefer something similar to VRV to be revived again. That would be lovely. |
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Redbeard 101
Oscar the Grouch
Forums Superstar Posts: 16939 |
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That is very misleading. It is also not the first time you've posted ridiculous claims and numbers that are misleading. For VRV (which gets you Sentai and Crunchy) it's $9.99 a month with tax for premium. Which also gets you all the other channels. That's roughly $120 a year. Let's round up generously for taxes to say $150 a year. Funimation is $5.99 a month for regular Premium which gets you subs and dubs, the entire library, and 2 concurent streams at the same time. The only real advantage of the premium plus is some extra member benefits that don't do much, and streaming to 5 devices concurrently. So at regular premium for $5.99 a month that's $72 bucks. Let's again round up for some taxes. Let's say $85 as a highball with taxes. Now you're at $235 a year for the vast majority of everything that streams. That gets you HiDive, Funi, & Crunchy plus all the extra channels on VRV. Let's add Netflix for good measure. You can save money and do the Basic. That's $8.99 a month. Let's be realistic though, you want HD. So for the HD plan that's $12.99 and you can stream to 2 devices at a time. That's $155.88 before taxes. Let's round up again to say $170. It's the most expensive service with the least amount of pure anime, but you get everything else on Netflix. Now you're at just over $400 a year, high balling the taxes mind you, for Netflix, Hi-Dive, Crunchy, and Funimation. Plus all the bonus content on Netflix and VRV outside of anime. The only way you're going to get up to over $600 a year is if you also add in Hulu Plus Streaming and Amazon Prime as well. The anime content on those services though, especially limited to just those services, is negligible at best. If you're subscribing to Hulu it's probably to replace cable. At which point the price for streaming live Hulu tv is already less than cable or dish right out the gate. So you're already saving money for that switch. Almost nobody gets Prime just for anime. You get Prime for either Prime video, perhaps Unlimited if you're a book reader, or more than likely for the shipping bonuses. They don't even license anime anymore. So while yes you might have to spend over $600 for ALL THE ANIME RELEASED in the west the fact is for roughly $235 you can get the VAST majority of anime released between Crunchy, Hi-Dive, and Funi. You also get those back catalogs as well. Which as someone who bought dvd singles....good god I could've saved a lot of money if I could've seen the future. Even if you get Netflix to bump up that percentage of anime it's basically $400 a year. That's $200 under your $600 plus figure for 90-95% of new anime released in a year, plus you get back catalogs. The statement that you made about having to subscribe to them all for just 50% of new anime is complete and utter bs. That's just simply wildly untrue. You could subscribe to just VRV (Crunchy and Hi-Dive) and Funi for roughly $235 and get the vast majority of new streaming anime each season. Netflix only gets a handful in a year. |
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Gem-Bug
Posts: 1217 |
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Thank you very much for taking the time to break that down. It definitely seems less daunting parsed out. |
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BigOnAnime
Encyclopedia Editor
Posts: 1232 Location: Minnesota, USA |
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Then there's this atrocious take, particulaly the first two points.
So, if something is not legally available and was never available for sale in the first place, one shouldn't be able to enjoy it? A good amount of piracy happens because it's simply not legally available. Make it legally available, and boom. There will always be some who will never pay for a variety of reasons, but others want legal options, but because there aren't any, they turn to piracy. Also guess how the US anime industry got its start? From piracy and fansubs, there wouldn't have been fans looking to bring anime over here and start up companies in the first place if VHS fansubs hadn't helped create an audience here. Though yes, there was also Japanese companies like Bandai and Pioneer (later Geneon) trying to bring it over as well. Second, eBay is a marketplace, not a retailer, and if you're buying something there, that's money that's not going into the industry, especially if it's an out of print release. Me buying an old Geneon or Bandai Entertainment DVD even brand new sealed isn't sending money back when their license has long since expired, and they themselves no longer exist. The second question in this old Answerman explains what happens when you buy those old releases.
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Cutiebunny
Posts: 1748 |
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I don't know how much Kougeru makes per year, but $235 for a large chunk of currently released titles might not be feasible. A lot of people around the world have lost their job or are working reduced hours and/or for reduced wages. Some of the comments here and on Twitter have reeked of elitism and I think that's really unfair to those who find their finances seriously compromised because of this global pandemic. I have consistently said on this site that I believe that people should support the industry as best they can and how they deem fit. Shaming them because they use illegal streaming sites, particularly when many of those criticizing have used them (or are using them because the title hasn't been localized, etc.) is hypocritical. Yes, I get that you now know better, can afford better, etc., but not everyone is in your position. The argument of "..then you don't get to have it" lacks compassion. To be quite honest, this attitude inspires me to want to bootleg more because why would I want anyone who treats others like this be in business any longer, particularly when it takes less than a minute to find a free alternative? Additionally, I would remember those who treated me like this while I was down on my luck and make sure to never support them even when I have the funds to do so. The only thing this resentment does is just continue to fuel the cycle. |
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capt_bunny
Posts: 364 |
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Sorry if I sound rude so please don't think I'm saying this in any mean tone. I don't think you're getting my point. Its not about the USA. It the fact that many cannot afford in their country or don't have it in their country. The fact that some have said "oh, just use VPN" or "wait and buy it on DVD" sounds so ignorant of other countries besides their own. If you can afford it then good for them. If they want to protest then that's their own dumb choice. However, the fact that they completely do not understand the struggles of overseas fans and non-first world countries says a lot to me. BigonAnime is exactly right about blaming overseas when you said you don't think so when they are. Go read what Christopher Wehkamp said on his replies about this. I agree on wanting VRV again but my 2nd paragraph and what you quoted is based on blaming those fans. The 1st paragraph relates to more of your reply. Maybe I'm just misunderstanding your reply to which, again I say, sorry. |
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Kindest_Regret
Posts: 1 |
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We from india can complain a lot because there are no legal streaming services to begin with crunchyroll premium doesn't have all thr titles and Netflix offers only very few good titles with only limited seasons for ex: haikyuu is on available on Netflix but it only has one season and when it comes to movies like kimi no no wa and tenki no ko i didn't see any of those movies except a silent voice on Netflix and some of the people tried reaching animelab they responded but they said they had no plans of expanding their services to the overseas but they said they hope to expand it one day and when it comes to funimationnow the site itself is not available in our region we used to have animax channel but for some reason even the channel was removed even from the sony liv app too so how does japan expect us to watch anime legally we even raised petitions to bring back animax channel we are not asking just give us some streaming services or at least one like funimation or animelab so that we can watch legally and support the anime industry
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ElectroEsper
Posts: 6 Location: Canada, Some no man's land |
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What is often passed over by these kind of analytics, is that availability is not necessarily the problem.
Anime osnnot a problem, me and a few friends share a subscription for that which brings the price down individually. For manga in my region, price is a massive barrier, going for around 4-5 times higher than in Japan per volume, sometimes higher if the bookstore consider it a "special order", which is prohibitive. And yes, bookstore is the cheaper option, because ordering online means transport fees, which themselves costs the same as a single volume |
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Kokushibou
Posts: 39 |
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It was surprising how much empathy some VAs were lacking on twitter. In my country I can only find 400 anime legally and that too if I subscribe to all available anime services here and even among those titles there are hardly any popular titles.
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tygerchickchibi
Posts: 1453 |
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No, I understand. I have been more or less ranting about some of the other points I saw made on this thread that I really am bothered with. I don't think you're being rude at all. When I made my first comment about "no one is being blamed overseas," I was strictly referring to the article. The first comment gave me the impression that the article was blaming international fans for lack of access--but the article was just informative. Then everyone started telling me about the US voice actors here. I stated the reasons why I think some of the VAs in the US may have such a specific view. I do believe that it was a little misguided, but I also understand why they took a hard stance. In short, there are mixed feelings on my end regarding the responses. There are a few voice actors that have shown support and have asked their peers to chill out tbh. At least I've seen them post publicly stating so. Anway, sorry for the confusion. I wish my first post was more clear about the article, but I see that gave a different impression overall. ^^;; -- On a side note, I think Chris Wehkamp's question was a good thing to ask. I don't think there's anything bad about it. Sometimes people gotta learn the hard way. Though....a lot of the responses seem to come from people who reside in the US. Last edited by tygerchickchibi on Thu Aug 20, 2020 8:36 am; edited 1 time in total |
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